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I need advise

  • 1.  I need advise

    Posted 01-26-2017 10:02 AM
    I have been working with a client who is building 4-plexes in two different subdivisions.  My drawings have been submitted to the first city (Shawnee, KS) and the client has received his permit.   He now wants to make a 2' revision to these drawings and use it on some of those 4-plexes (19 total 4-plexes).  He also wants to use a different architect.  I don't have a problem with the 2' revision nor do I have a problem with his using a different architect for the second subdivision.  But I'm afraid switching architects in the middle of the first set of 4-plexes will cause legal issues for me.  He also would like to continue to use my design/drawings.  Any suggestions for how to handle this?

    Thanks so much,

    Lynn Gentry, AIA
    Gentry Design Studio, LLC
    Olathe, KS


  • 2.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 05:32 PM
    Seems to me your "legal issues"  would travel wherever your design and drawings go.   In other words, as long as he is building from your plans, you will be the one liable for any errors/omissions suit.  Traditionally your best defense against that sort of thing would be to maintain a close watch on the construction to assure that everything is built according to your plans and specs.  So you should not leave this relationship until the project you designed is complete.
    I think if the client wants to terminate your relationship and work with someone else, then you should not allow your design and drawings to be used, without being paid a suitable amount for your expertise and liability.    You should be paid some amount for every time the plans are used, and you should have ready access to observe the construction at will.   Without those, you should walk away and take your drawings with you, but not until the first 4plex is finished.


    Bruce Ward, Architect
    (315) 824-1094
    7122 Springhill Rd.
    Hamilton, NY 13346


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    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 05:41 PM
    Your Agreement with the Owner should include language that addresses the circumstances you describe.

    ------------------------------
    Albert Russell AIA
    Architect
    Albert R. Russell, Architect
    Milton VT
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 05:42 PM
    As you are the architect of record for the first 4-plex, only you can make revisions to your plans.  If that set of sealed drawings was used for multiple lots that required separate permits, you would need to submit revisions for all permitted sites using those drawings.

    As far as the owner using another architect for the subsequent sites, I would not turn over your CAD files.  The other architect is required to produce his own drawings, not just copy and seal yours for the project.  If you want to be a nice guy, I would only give him PDF files.  I am not sure what contract you have with the client, but AIA contracts stipulate using plans for other projects cannot be done.  If you do decide to let your plans and design go to another architect, I would have a lawyer draft a letter stating that you are not liable for those plans and have your client sign it.

    I am curious that if your client liked your work enough to build it, why would he not engage you to continue working with him. Perhaps his other subdivision is in Missouri, and you are only licensed in Kansas.  But if another architect has to recreate construction documents form your plans, it would seem it would cost your client more money than to have you do it.

    Good luck, and do not be so quick to give away your designs and work. 

    ------------------------------
    Jeffrey Bumb AIA
    Fox Architects
    Saint Louis MO
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 05:43 PM
    Lynn, For other architect to use your drawings for 2' modification, you should have the other architect sign an indemnification agreement, indemnifying you for any changes "new architect" makes. For phase 2, when you say "use my drawings" do you mean your design (copyrighted) or your actual construction documents. Either way, you really should be compensated, especially if they utilized your CD's you still have liability unless they take all your information and put it on their title block. In that case you should be issuing the new architect a copyright license (if you only want them to use your info for a specific project) or a fully copyright release (if you want to grant them permission to use your intellectual  property for this and any other project they get in the future). You may want to consult an attorney to draft up the agreement.

    ------------------------------
    Richard Tokarski AIA
    Principal
    Tokarski & Milleman Architects
    Brick NJ
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 05:56 PM

    Hello, Lynn M. Gentry,

     

    Good question!  In many years of private practice, we occasionally ran into similar requests from (thankfully) only a few clients.  I hope that other architects will reply as well and then you can make the business and architectural decisions that are in YOUR best interests.

     

    We always asked ourselves, what was our risk and liability if our plans were re-used?  Did the "slight" modification (2 ft.) relieve us of liability?  Were we given appropriate credit for the design, even with changes?  And did we want to be credited with the design, if it didn't turn out so well?  Assuming that the client had fully paid us on the first project, did that entitle the client to use the plans for free thereafter, over and over again, and likely without our services during construction?    

     

    We weren't the fastest learners, but I would encourage any architect to not undervalue your services – don't sell yourself short.

     

    Martha Peck Andrews, FAIA

    Portland, Oregon




    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 06:18 PM
    Have you shared this with your insurance company? They will have good advice.

    Sent from my iPad


    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 06:40 PM
    I would suggest you talk with the other architect. I don't know how he or she could take over without redrawing your entire set of drawings without engaging in plan stamping. You may want to talk to your registration board about their understanding of such matters. If they reuse your plans I would think you would expect to be paid for your work for the risk if nothing else.


    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-30-2017 06:49 PM
    Hi Peter,

    I am curious to find out who the other architect is.  I am not sure my client understands our license restrictions.  I would certainly not take over this project from someone else.  Thank you for your response.

    Lynn

    ------------------------------
    Lynn Gentry AIA
    Principal
    Gentry Design Studio, LLC
    Olathe KS
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 07:06 PM
    I am not a lawyer, but I would suggest that by allowing the client to use your drawings, even with modest changes, for a different project would put you at risk and violate the standard AIA contracts.  Drawings are instruments of service intended for use in constructing a specific project.  You own them, not the client.  

    Two suggestions: 1. Copyright all your work.  That provides some additional protection.  2. Talk to your Professional Liability provider.  They can explain your risks to you.

    Good luck.



    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 09:06 PM
    I  suggest you notify the City that you have been informed that other parties may be making revisions to the documents which you prepared and which the City approved. Tell the City that you are no longer serving as architect of record and that you accept no liability for changes made to your documents.  Contact the other architect and offer them a release of your copyright (as they modify it) in exchange for a full assumption of all responsibility for design.  Retain your rights to the original design.  Work out the wording with a lawyer.  Notify your professional liability insurer and take advantage of any counsel they give you. 
    You do have vicarious liability for use of your documents, even if you haven't participated in the modifications. Something falls down, and Architect #2 says "well we didn't change that part; so it's not our fault".
    Treat the transfer, which you seem to be willing to accept, as just another business transaction.

    ------------------------------
    Joel Niemi AIA
    Joel Niemi Architect
    Snohomish, WA
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-27-2017 10:36 PM
    I wonder why he wants to change architects while continuing to build your design with or without an additional 2'.
    Have you asked him or her  why a change of architects?

    Bob Reinhardt, AIA
    Reinhardt Architects
    Custom Residential Architecture
    http://www.reinhardt-architect.com
    301-949-7554



    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-28-2017 09:01 AM
    First immediately advise your insurance carrier.  They will have advice as it applies to your insurance.

    I don't know what kind of contract you have with the owner but I would advise him that the work product is yours and that he cannot us it for any revisions to be made by another architect.  Too much legal responsibility.

    John A. Feick, AIA, CSI, LEED AP
    224 East Water Street
    Sandusky, Ohio 44870
    419-625-2554 (w)
    419-656-3017 (c)
     



    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-28-2017 01:05 PM
    Talk to your Liability Insurance company and get advice from their Attorney. Something similar happened to me recently. The Attorney told me what to write in a letter about terminating my work with this client (under contract). All the information is in you AIA contract.


    Original Message


  • 15.  RE: I need advise

    Posted 01-28-2017 05:19 PM

    Lynn,

     

    You own the intellectual property represented in the CD set as well as design drawings and any presentation sales material you may have produced.  The client cannot take your drawings and give them to another architect unless you give permission to do so.  If you are amenable to that, the client and yourself should sign a release.  I would suggest you're completely paid before you sign the release and include in it language that releases you off all liability for the project.  (You cannot allow yourself to be liable for a project you will not be able to visit and confirm the construction matches your plans.) Additionally, it's typical for you to get royalty payments if the client uses your work on new projects.  You can make that part of the release agreement and it will protect you if the client builds 10 more complexes.

     

    Now I do realize the client may object, and then I would recommend you speak to the other architect.  Warn the other professional he does not have the right to use your work.  You can and should also advise the building department in writing.  Some may do nothing and others issue a stop work order if they require an architect be responsible for the construction to meet building codes.

     

    Good Luck,

    Laura Smiros, AIA




    Original Message